Christians: Trust Jews of the First Century but Distrust Jews of the Second, Third, and… Centuries

Nazi propaganda:  The eternal (evil) Jew

Ask any conservative Christian apologist why modern people living 2,000 years after the death of Jesus can trust the reliability of the stories about him in the four Gospels and the apologist will likely reply:

The Jews of the first century were meticulous about maintaining the accuracy of the Hebrew Bible, the Old Testament.  In fact, the Word of God was so precious to them that the Jews of the first century would memorize their oral traditions, word for word!  Jews had been following this meticulous practice of maintaining the accuracy of their oral traditions ever since they received the Law of Moses from God at Mt. Sinai.  We can therefore be certain that the Jewish authors of the Gospels accurately recorded the information about the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus from the oral traditions of the original eyewitnesses, the Jewish disciples of Jesus!

Now ask the same Christian apologist why it is that modern Jews reject the Christian claim that the Old Testament is full of prophecies which predict that Jesus will come as the Messiah, and this is the response you will likely receive:

After the death of Jesus, the Jewish rabbis deliberately edited Jesus out of the Hebrew Bible.  They changed and corrupted the Hebrew Bible in the first few centuries after Jesus’ death.  Jewish rabbis have been concealing this diabolical act of corrupting God’s Word from unsuspecting Jews ever since.  But we Christians know what they did.

Yes, those evil, conniving Jews!  The evil Jews rejected the Gospel of Jesus.  The evil Jews killed Jesus.  Then the evil Jews distorted and corrupted the Old Testament.  Evil, wicked, diabolic Jews!  Here is a quote from one Christian website about modern Jewish rabbis:

The rabbis know that no matter what they say, those who believe in them [Jews] will accept and follow their decrees, even if they are wrong or making things up. After all, the Talmud demands blind faith from its believers.

Source

And here is another:

When the overall sense of the passage cannot be hidden (as with Isa. 52:13-53:5) the Jewish rabbis and translators who have lived after Jesus Christ have changed it because they cannot believe it refers to Jesus.  …God has given them [the Jews] signs that Jesus is the Messiah, but they do not want to believe. They seek a Messiah of their own making and desire. But there is only One who will establish an eternal government and bring everlasting peace and it is the Messiah Jesus Christ.  Today the Jewish people are spiritually blind. They seek a Messiah who has already come. They were not looking for a Messiah who would rescue them from their sins thus giving them eternal life and also be their king forever. Jesus Christ is both a glorious spiritual savior and future king.

Source

Dear Readers, imagine the reaction of Christians if Muslim scholars claimed that Christian bishops and pastors in the second and third centuries CE intentionally and deceptively corrupted the original New Testament writings so that Christians would not see that Mohammad was prophesied to come after Jesus, to bring the final revelation from God as recorded in the Koran?  Christians would be outraged.  Yet Christians have the audacity to do the very same thing to Jews.

It’s disgusting.  It’s bigotry.  It’s anti-Semitism.

Image result for image of say no to bigotry

12 thoughts on “Christians: Trust Jews of the First Century but Distrust Jews of the Second, Third, and… Centuries

  1. funny thing about some of these claims that the Jews changed their scriptures: the Dead Sea Scrolls (the ones that are of biblical scripture) and the corresponding texts in a modern Hebrew Tanach are virtually identical. If anything, it attests to the insistence among the Jews of diligently keeping the Tanach intact.

    ” Qumran, however, has provided remains of an early Masoretic edition predating the Christian era on which the traditional MT is based. A comparison of the MT to this earlier text revealed the remarkable accuracy with which scribes copied the sacred texts. Accordingly, the integrity of the Hebrew Bible was confirmed…” [ Brantley ]

    This “continuity of accuracy” of the Tanach is probably the most significant thing about the Dead Sea Scrolls (and, there are lot’s of very significant things about them).

    Example:

    TABLE 1. QUMRAN VS. THE MASORETES
    ______________________________________
    Of the 166 Hebrew words in Isaiah 53, only
    seventeen letters in Dead Sea Scroll 1QIsb
    differ from the Masoretic Text (Geisler and
    Nix, 1986, p. 382).

    10 letters = spelling differences
    4 letters = stylistic changes
    3 letters = added word for “light” (vs. 11)
    ______________________________________
    17 letters = no affect on biblical teaching

    I really don’t know where some of these guys come up with stuff like “they changed the Old Testament to take Jesus out of it”…

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    1. Yes there is a MT parent in Hebrew at Qumran that does not change the fact that the LXX Hebrew parent is also there and is much older. That information does not change the argument.

      I have answers to all the nonsense fro Jews for Judaism, (fundamentalists for Judaism)

      read my pages on the Religious a priori

      Jesus Christ KingMessiah

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    2. Bond the reason for pouting out the superiority of the LXX is because it was the Bible of the early church. That means all the Messianic predictions that Jesus fulfills are in theLXX. skeptics and Jewish fudnies point out how they get it wrong like ps 22 it says you dig at my hands instead of my hands and feet are priced., that is the MT the LXX does say pierced.

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        1. Gary trying to play the racism card just says tome you give p you know are wrong you can’t beat the arguments so you have to resort to name calling and political card paying. It also shows that you don;t grasp the issues, You say

          “imagine the reaction of Christians if Muslim scholars claimed that Christian bishops and pastors in the second and third centuries CE intentionally and deceptively corrupted the original New Testament writings so that Christians would not see that Mohammad was prophesied to come after Jesus, to bring the final revelation from God as recorded in the Koran? Christians would be outraged. Yet Christians have the audacity to do the very same thing to Jews.”

          Joe Doesn’t apply for a couple of reasons. Firsrt, Jews did change their expectations and their Greek Translation after the destruction of the temple. Srconly it;s ot a matter of corrupting the text it;s a matter of choosing a different batch of MS. they didn’t set out to change the texts of the Bible but over time change happens.They chose the different MS that did not lend themselves to Jesus’ fulfillment.

          That is not a matter of opinion it’s a fact, modern Judaism uses the MT and early church used the LXX.

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          1. The Real Jesus site (visted 8/4/06)

            “…According to Frank Moore Cross (another DSS scholar) there are at least 3 ‘families’ of texts at Qumran : the MT ‘family’, the ‘Egyptian’ family, and a ‘Palestinian’ family . The ‘Egyptian’ version which, among other things, has a different version of Jeremiah, became the basis for the LXX. The ‘Palestinian ‘ became the basis for the Samaritan version. The MT variety was the ancestor of what we use today–although even within these ‘families’ there was sometimes variation. We do not know which version was being used by, say, the Sadducees of the Temple sect, or even which the Essenes themselves used. The Jewish community at Alexandria evidently used the Egyptian ‘family’ or the LXX.” – Randolph Parrish

            “The ‘biblical’ library of Qumran represents a fluid stage of the biblical text. Those documents show no influence of the rabbinic recension of the canon, the direct ancestor of the traditional Hebrew Bible. The scrolls help to place both the Pharisaic text and the canon in the era of Hillel, roughly the time of Jesus. In their selection of canonical books, the rabbis excluded those attributed to prophets or Patriarchs before Moses (e.g., the Enoch literature, works written in the name of Abraham and other Patriarchs). They traced the succession of prophets from Moses to figures of the Persian period. Late works were excluded, with the exception of Daniel, which, the rabbis presumably, attributed to the Persian period.”

            – Frank Moore Cross, Jr., “Dead Sea Scrolls: Overview”

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          2. Why base your beliefs about the Hebrew God from a Greek translation instead of the original Hebrew? It is irrelevant if the text used during Jesus life was the LXX. The original Hebrew is superior to a foreign translation.

            In addition, According to Rabbi Skobac, Jews only translated the Torah into Greek. There is no evidence that Jews translated the entire Tanach (complete Old Testament) into Greek. It is therefore possible that Christians created the majority of the LXX.

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  2. James A. Sanders,Inter Testamental and Biblical Studies at Clairmont, Cannon and Community, a Guide to Canonical Criticism. Philladelphia: Forterss Press, 1984, 15-16.

    “There are remarkable differences between the LXX and MT of 1 and 2 Sam. Jeremiah, Esther, Daniel, Proverbs and Ezekiel, 40-48, and on a lesser level numerious very important differences in lesser books such as Isaiah and Job. Before the discovery of the Scrolls [Dead Sea] it was difficult to know wheather most of these should be seen as translational, Or as reflecting the inner history of the Septuegent text, or all three. Now it is abundantly clear that the second period of text transmission [which is BC], actually that of the earliest texts we have, was one of limited textual pluralism. Side by side in the Qumran library lay scrolls of Jeremiah in Hebrew dating to the pre-Chrsitian Hellenistic period reflecting both the textual tradition known in the MT and the one in the LXX without any indication of preference. So also for 1 and 2 Sam.”

    [note: the importance of 1 and 2 sam and Jeremiah, Esther, Daniel is that it indicates the LXX existed before the time of Christ in more than the Pentetucahal form]

    Institue for Biblcal and scientific studies

    OT Dead Sea Scrolls.

    The Dead Sea Scrolls (DSS) like the magnificent Isaiah scroll closely follow the Masoretic Text (MT), but there are a few exceptions. For example, Psalm 145 is an alphabetical psalm. Each verse begins with the next letter in the alphabet, but “N” is missing in the MT. In the DSS it is there, so somehow a scribe left this verse out. Another important difference is in I Samuel 11 where the MT is shortened. The longer reading in the DSS explains what happens in this chapter.

    Three of the most important Biblical texts from Qumran are: (1) The Isaiah Scroll from Cave 1 which has two different text types, with about 1,375 differences from the MT. (2) The Habakkuk Commentary from Cave 1 which uses the pesher method of interpretation, and the name Yahweh is written in paleo-Hebrew. (3) The Psalm scroll from Cave 11 contains 41 canonical psalms and 7 apocryphal psalms mixed in among them. The order of the psalms differs largely from the MT (Wurthwein 1979, 32).

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    1. Why base your beliefs about the Hebrew God from a Greek translation instead of the original Greek?

      You mean the original Hebrew?

      It is irrelevant if the text used during Jesus life was the LXX.(septuagent) The original Hebrew is superior to a foreign translation.

      It is relevant because the early church used the LXX as their Bible. I thought you understood that I’ve said it several times now,the reason they used Greek so much in busies and dealing with Romans and people from other places they hardly ever spoke Hebrew .

      In addition, According to Rabbi Skobac, Jews only translated the Torah into Greek. There is no evidence that Jews translated the entire Tanach (complete Old Testament) into Greek. It is therefore possible that Christians created the majority of the LXX.

      That’s c;ear;y BS because we have the translation it was done latter,

      But here is the crucial point. a vastly educated Guy like you should grasp this,the translation of the LXX used a different set of Ms than that used latter in the MT. These are called the Hebrew Parent Text. These are what they are talking about when they say they found them at Qumran,Not actual Greek (the did have some) but mostly the Hebrew pattern of the LXX version, that’s what is a thousand years older than the MT.

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  3. St Justin Martyr (c. AD 100 – 165) supported the Septuagint and claimed that the Jews altered their Scriptures:

    “But I am far from putting reliance in your teachers, who refuse to admit that the interpretation [Septuagint/LXX] made by the seventy elders who were with Ptolemy [king] of the Egyptians is a correct one; and they attempt to frame another. And I wish you to observe, that they have altogether taken away many Scriptures from the translations effected by those seventy elders who were with Ptolemy, and by which this very man who was crucified is proved to have been set forth expressly as God, and man, and as being crucified, and as dying; but since I am aware that this is denied by all of your nation, I do not address myself to these points, but I proceed to carry on my discussions by means of those passages which are still admitted by you. For you assent to those which I have brought before your attention, except that you contradict the statement, ‘Behold, the virgin shall conceive,’ and say it ought to be read, ‘Behold, the young woman shall conceive.’ And I promised to prove that the prophecy referred, not, as you were taught, to Hezekiah, but to this Christ of mine: and now I shall go to the proof.” Here Trypho remarked, “We ask you first of all to tell us some of the Scriptures which you allege have been completely cancelled.” – St Justin Martyr, Dialogue with Trypho, Chapter LXXI

    Source: ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.viii.iv.lxxi.html1

    And I said, “I shall do as you please. From the statements, then, which Esdras [Ezra] made in reference to the law of the passover, they have taken away the following: ‘And Esdras said to the people, This passover is our Saviour and our refuge. And if you have understood, and your heart has taken it in, that we shall humble Him on a standard, and thereafter hope in Him, then this place shall not be forsaken for ever, says the God of hosts. But if you will not believe Him, and will not listen to His declaration, you shall be a laughing-stock to the nations.’ And from the sayings of Jeremiah they have cut out the following: ‘I [was] like a lamb that is brought to the slaughter: they devised a device against me, saying, Come, let us lay on wood on His bread, and let us blot Him out from the land of the living; and His name shall no more be remembered.’ And since this passage from the sayings of Jeremiah is still written in some copies [of the Scriptures] in the synagogues of the Jews (for it is only a short time since they were cut out), and since from these words it is demonstrated that the Jews deliberated about the Christ Himself, to crucify and put Him to death, He Himself is both declared to be led as a sheep to the slaughter, as was predicted by Isaiah, and is here represented as a harmless lamb; but being in a difficulty about them, they give themselves over to blasphemy. And again, from the sayings of the same Jeremiah these have been cut out: ‘The Lord God remembered His dead people of Israel who lay in the graves; and He descended to preach to them His own salvation.’ – St Justin Martyr, Dialogue with Trypho, Chapter LXXII

    Source: ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.viii.iv.lxxii.html

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